Season 2 Episode 4: Dr Angela Genoni - Life on Purpose over 40

Gut Health After 40: The Missing Link to Hormones, Bones & Confidence

Gut health is one of the most powerful yet overlooked aspects of women’s health after 40. As we move through perimenopause and menopause, changes in estrogen levels directly affect the gut microbiome — influencing everything from hormone balance and bone density to mood, energy, weight management, and overall well-being.

In this episode of Life on Purpose Over 40, I sit down with Dr. Angela Genoni, gut health expert and author of A Peaceful Gut, Mind and Body, to unpack the science behind the gut-hormone connection. You’ll discover:

Why gut health is critical for women over 40 and during menopause
The surprising link between gut bacteria and bone health (“the gut-bone axis”)
How declining estrogen impacts gut barrier function and inflammation
Why fiber is the #1 nutrient women over 40 need more of (and why it’s not just one compound but hundreds of different plant-based molecules)
Simple, sustainable nutrition strategies to improve digestion, boost energy, and support long-term health

Unlike quick-fix diets or supplement fads, Dr. Genoni’s approach focuses on compassionate, confidence-building nutrition — helping women create small, positive changes that last. This episode is a must-listen if you’re searching for natural gut health solutions for women over 40, strategies for hormone balance, or practical ways to thrive in midlife.

Visit gutscience.au to access Dr. Genoni’s free gut health masterclass and learn more about her book A Peaceful Gut, Mind and Body.

www.threads.com/@angela_genoni

TRANSCRIPT

Dr Angela Genoni: 0:00

I really saw a gap in the way that science is communicated to people, particularly women, and I really felt a calling to just get out there and be a part of solving some big problems. Not against supplements, but I think I’m against the marketing of them and I’m against the way that they’re pushed on women and vulnerable women and it makes us feel like we’re not actually good enough just as we are and so we need them. Most things in nutrition, more does not equal better, but for fiber, more is better and the more that you can fit into your diet, the healthier your gut environment will be.Caroline Balinska: 0:37

Welcome to the Life on Purpose Over 40 podcast, where empowerment, elegance and health take center stage. I’ll be your guide on this thrilling journey to outshine your past self. This is a podcast all about transformation. We’re plunging headfirst into exactly what health, wellness, style, relationships and career look like as a woman over 40. You’ll be hearing from all the most sought after global trailblazers and experts. This isn’t just about learning. It’s about embracing your inner, fierce, fabulous self.Caroline Balinska: 1:08

Let’s get started. Hi, welcome back to the podcast. We have Angela Giannoni with us today. Dr Angela Giannoni, thank you for joining us today. Thank you for having me. I’m very excited to have a chat Fantastic Now.Caroline Balinska: 1:25

We were just talking before we actually started recording and I had to say say, we have to push record because we were getting so far into our conversation. And it’s so lovely to talk to you because I think women, especially women over 40, do not realize how important gut health is. And something you mentioned I had a note here that I wanted to ask you about is that there’s so much BS out there. There’s so many things that we’re told so many fake stories, so many confusing, conflicting pieces of information that we just don’t know where to take this information sometimes.Caroline Balinska: 1:53

And what I really wanted to have you on here. I found you on threads and I found some things that you’re talking about and I said, oh my God, I need to have you because I think that you can help us clear up some things that are making our lives harder. I think, making our lives much, much harder than they need to be. So let’s start off by talking about a little bit about your background, what you do how you became a doctor in this area and let us know why you’re so passionate about gut health.Dr Angela Genoni: 2:22

Well, that’s a good way to start, actually, because I kind of love telling this story.Dr Angela Genoni: 2:26

So I’m a nutritionist and that’s my background in my training, and I graduated as a nutritionist over 20 years ago now, so quite a long time ago.Dr Angela Genoni: 2:35

But when my kids were little I had a bit of time off when I had babies and I have three boys and so I had three boys in three years and when they were very small I thought I wanted to, you know, get back into the workforce and I thought doing a research degree would be a great way to get back to work, because it’s pretty flexible and in Australia, if you are lucky enough, you can get a scholarship which pays you to do your research degree.Dr Angela Genoni: 3:06

So I was lucky enough to get one of those and managing that with three small children under my feet was rather a challenge. And I wasn’t entirely sure about studying gut health at the outset but because I knew that I would be in the lab with poo samples for a few years. But I said yes, embraced the challenge and, honestly, it was the best thing I’ve ever done in my life. I just learned so much and I think having kids while I was studying, kids at home while I was studying and dealing with some pretty complex situation at home which I had to sort of since exit myself from, has given me a really unique perspective on the science and I really feel like we need to bring some compassion and kindness back to nutrition and gut health. And I really saw a gap in the way that science is communicated to people, particularly women, and I really felt a calling to just get out there and be a part of solving some big problems.Caroline Balinska: 4:14

I love that. You mentioned a word there that I found really interesting and I just want to throw in there. You have a new book, which you just told me off air because you’re just getting it at the moment. But there’s a book you just wrote called A Peaceful Gut, mind and Body, and then she used the word compassion. So can you just explain that a little bit more? What do you mean by that being more compassionate?Dr Angela Genoni: 4:37

So I think this is a really important thing for women, because on our social media feeds, like every day, we see, you know, weight loss stories and supplements being pushed at us and even actually quite um, coercively almost, the people that are trying to affiliately sell you something by being nice to you.Dr Angela Genoni: 5:00

So you don’t really even know if that person on the other end of the conversation that you might be having is genuine or whether they’re just trying to flog you a supplement.Dr Angela Genoni: 5:08

So I think it’s become so marketing driven across many platforms that one it’s hard to work out what the true picture and story is. What the true picture and story is and, secondly, the effect that has on us mentally is it makes us feel like we’re not good enough as we are, and I really want to try and flip the script on that, because once you understand a bit more about what your body does on the inside and how it works and particularly the gut microbiome because it is pretty damn cool you can really start to have a new respect and love for yourself, and that love and respect spills over to many other things in your life, including wanting to nurture yourself better and then being able to see through some of that stuff that’s thrown in your face every day and having the empowerment to decide for yourself if you need that or not. And education is power right, and so I want to help particularly women get that back, because I think we lost it somewhere.Caroline Balinska: 6:22

Yeah, I agree and so many thoughts are going through my head as you were saying that, for example, there’s a lot of evidence now talking about how the gut and the brain are so connected and there’s so much more research about how gut health can equal mental health and can lower depression rates there’s a huge amount of research going into that at the moment and can lower depression rates. There’s a huge amount of research going into that at the moment. And I think that it plays on what you just said of that as women, we don’t think we’re good enough and we look at what everyone else is doing. I was just listening to a podcast yesterday and they were saying, oh, as women, especially over 40, here we are worried about that. We’re not good enough. But everything all the marketing out there is for women under the age of 40. It’s coming from 25 year old women that look amazing and it’s like, yeah, of course their bodies look amazing. And then they’re selling us, like you said, a supplement and it’s just crazy.Caroline Balinska: 7:16

And then the other side of it that I was thinking of was Andrew Huberman, for example. Love the guy, I think he’s brilliant in so many ways, but I was just watching a um an expose on him and what he’s been doing and how he’s been pushing this um green supplements and they speak about how he’s been pushing that and really I respect him in so many ways, but in other ways I think he’s just about the money now and him. He’s selling this supplement that they’ve actually proven on his website. He talks about the science of it, but they show no science-based evidence about it, which is disrespectful and, like you said, what I don’t like is that what it makes us think is, oh, we must not be good enough because we need to take these supplements, and he’s telling us the truth.Caroline Balinska: 8:06

So he’s trying to help us and he’s not actually trying to help us. He’s trying to help his back pocket. That’s what he’s trying to help, and I wrote down here before we got on the call one big thing that I think that you mentioned supplements. I do take some supplements, but that’s because of all the tests that I’ve been getting done about hormones. However, I love your idea of no supplements, because I think that one thing that we do wrong in our society is we jump straight to supplements. I agree, we don’t try to go into what we need first. I think that’s what you mean by that. So if you want to just go into that a little bit more, let’s talk about supplements and what you mean by no supplements, and explain that to us about supplements.Dr Angela Genoni: 8:53

So I don’t disagree with supplements and there are a few that I routinely do sort of say to people that they could probably take. So I’m not against supplements, but I think I’m against the marketing of them and I’m against the way that they’re pushed on women and vulnerable women and it makes us feel like we’re not actually good enough just as we are and so we need them. And that marketing is. I don’t think it helps build us up. In fact I think it puts us down mentally. And so when you understand a bit more about your body and how it works and what you might need for yourself, then you can decide for yourself if you do think you need a supplement or not. You do think you need a supplement or not.Dr Angela Genoni: 9:47

And then the other part of that equation is that the gut microbiome is and I call it in my book I refer to it as an Amazon rainforest because, let’s face it, it is. It’s this beautiful ecosystem in there, and when you think about a rainforest you think about how it’s in balance. Right, you wouldn’t introduce a new weed into the rainforest without some really hard science, showing that it’s not going to take over the forest and be a pest in the bush, as has happened in Australia. I don’t think we’ve done it.Dr Angela Genoni: 10:22

There’s many plants that have been introduced into Australia which, have you know, have run wild and haven’t gone well so, and our gut is very much the same. And so when a lot of new supplements come on the market and there are so many new ones at the moment, the testing that is done on them, or the clinical trials to support what they say about them, are usually done on very small populations of people. So if you go and read the science behind them, it might say a small pilot study of 20 people showed this effect. But in those studies they very rarely test the impact on the gut microbiome and they very rarely test longer than a four to four week to two month time period. So my other problem with with them is that we don’t really understand what we’re messing with, like we’re taking. We take a lot of things sometimes, but do they reach to the gut microbiome? Yeah, probably a good portion of them do. What effect do they have reach the gut microbiome? Yeah, probably a good portion of them do. What effect do they have in the gut microbiome? Is it favorable or is it unfavorable? Or is it just going to take some time to be unfavorable? And we don’t know the answers to most of those yet.Dr Angela Genoni: 11:38

So I think we are right to be a bit more cautious with what we put in our mouth, and that applies to supplements as well, as you know, other things like some of the ultra-processed foods that we should also be wary of. But so I’m very big on maintaining my no supplements. I don’t upsell people on supplements, I should say, because too often there’s creators out there that promote a course or promote something, but then they try and affiliate you or bombard you with oh, buy this product, it’s 20% off as well, like you say for Huberman, lining the back pocket in the meantime, and I disagree with that. I think it’s got to be a science first approach which builds people up rather than making makes them feel like they’re not good enough as they are yeah, I’m.Caroline Balinska: 12:38

I’m a really big believer in what you just said, and we were speaking off air that, um, I’ve had a lot of gut issues myself. So for me, I’m very passionate about that and I work very closely. I work with a doctor in Germany that I do all this marketing and like back-end admin business stuff for, and he’s very much about understanding blood work first and he’s all about gut health and he’s all about understanding what people need and creating vitamins based on what that actual person needs at that particular time. And because I work so closely with him and I take care of all his like email stuff and I’m helping him with his marketing, I’m learning a lot about that.Caroline Balinska: 13:21

And one thing that I’m really understanding is how we’re really moving into a time period where everything’s going to be completely custom for each person, that there’s not going to be a shelf at the supermarket with all these vitamins on the shelf anymore. There’s going to be your vitamins and that’s it, like we’ve got it with hair care, we’ve got it with skincare already, and the vitamin market will move into that. So these like green supplements are not going to be a thing. And I think one thing I found myself I didn’t.Caroline Balinska: 13:51

I didn’t take that Andrew Hoover one, but I did take some sort of like um one of these sort of fancy green raw things or whatever you want to call them, and because of my stomach issues, I find that there’s very particular things that I just need to stay away from that just make me sick, no matter what. I think that what happens a lot of the time and you can tell me if this is right or wrong and how you’ve seen it with your own patients we get told to take something, so we go out and we take it. We weren’t feeling well so we went and took it, and then we find that that has just we don’t realize, but we think that that’s making us better, but we’re wondering why we’re not fixed yet. And then we blame ourselves like I’m not fixed, what am I doing wrong? I must be the problem because this thing that I was given is not making me better.Caroline Balinska: 14:42

So I’m the one at fault here and I think that there’s this really better. So I’m the one at fault here and I think that there’s this really ugly cycle that happens. And one thing I did learn along the way with all of my stomach things is how much natural foods can help us. Give us a lot of those vitamins, the raw vegetables and things like that that we get from these supplements we can get from food. So I don’t know how much you see that this cycle of women taking something and then it’s actually making it worse for them in many ways.Dr Angela Genoni: 15:12

Yeah, and I think most people that I speak to have got like the supplement drawer or the supplement cupboard, where they’ve bought something because it was promoted to them and they’ve wanted it for a certain reason, but they took it for a few weeks and that one they either didn’t feel better or two, it might have given them some other random side effect that they weren’t expecting, and so they they stopped taking it, they put it in the cupboard and it goes in the supplement graveyard, never to be taken again or taken again some other time point.Dr Angela Genoni: 15:47

But you know, I think we can all relate to having a lot of supplements in the cupboard that we never finished the bottle of, because they were promising something but they didn’t, they didn’t fix us, and then so, yeah, we end up in this loop of then looking for the next one to try something else to build us up, and so I want to step in and break that cycle for people and help them understand how to feed their gut properly, so that you don’t need to rely on supplements and you can use them if you want to. But then you understand what you’re buying and what you might specifically need it for and what you can expect from it and that’s really empowering, particularly for women, because, you know, stepping off that wagon of feeling like we have to consume all these things all the time is a big deal for many people.Caroline Balinska: 16:40

Yeah, and what do you think about with all the research you’ve done? Is there any difference? Okay, first of all, is there any difference with women who are in, say, their 20s and 30s, compared to women in their 40s, going into their 50s, into their 60s, when it comes to nutrition that they need to think about? What do you? Are you seeing any differences there?Dr Angela Genoni: 17:02

yeah. So what the research is showing at the moment for, and particularly in the field of gut health and nutrition, is that as estrogen starts to decline as we head into perimenopause and menopause, that estrogen plays a role in maintaining the barrier of our gut lining. So in your colon, which is where your gut microbiome lives, you’ve got these, the cells which are stuck together like quite nicely. But when the estrogen starts to drop, those gaps between the cells can become more apparent and what happens is little particles of food and bacteria that are not meant to be let into the bloodstream end up in the bloodstream and that can trigger a bit of, you know, underlying low-grade inflammation, and I think most women can relate to feeling a bit more aches and pains and, you know, just irritated All of it. It can influence everything from our mood to our sleep, to other hormone levels. So you know it’s a big deal, but the question is, how do we manage that? So during that period we’ve got this many different types of fruits and vegetables that we can eat that can actually help support bringing those cells back together again and maintaining the gut lining so that that inflammation cascade is reduced, and we also know that your gut can also maintain or help maintain your bone density and we know, as we get older.Dr Angela Genoni: 18:38

I think we’ve all heard and we all know that we should be doing some more weight training type exercises as we get older and we all need to make sure we’re eating enough calcium and protein.Dr Angela Genoni: 18:48

But one thing that’s kind of been missed in this conversation is that the health of your gut can really delay the rate of your bones breaking down. So there’s specific bacterial species that can inhibit your bone breakdown, which is like the coolest science ever. When I heard about this gut-bone axis I was like what, what, what? And then you know, you read into the science and the mechanisms behind it and what’s happening and it is just like the coolest thing ever because our gut can communicate with every part of our body and we have totally dismissed the significance of that in science up until now. And, yeah, understanding that midlife or in our 40s is a crucial time for us to have better gut health, even if we aren’t having gut issues, because, one, it can help us manage our menopause journey and, two, it can help maintain our bones and basically we can all feel better as well, and I think we can all relate to wanting to get through that phase of our life without feeling terrible.Caroline Balinska: 19:58

Yeah, that’s amazing. I didn’t know about that, but I think a statistic I heard a few years ago was that when you break a bone over the age of 60 I think it is, I don’t know if you know the stats better on this when you break a bone over the age of 60, you have x amount times more chance of dying within 12 months of that happening yeah I don’t know if you know the actual, but it’s a crazy statistic, yeah it’s really high and they’re saying that because we need to look after our bones.Caroline Balinska: 20:26

If we have bad bone health, then you have a huge chance of dying early.Dr Angela Genoni: 20:32

Yeah, and and you know once you think about how horrible it is to recover from any kind of broken bone but do that when you’re a bit older and make it one of the most critical bones in your body, like a hip or something major, and it takes away all your mobility and your independence, then mentally that can be very tough and people don’t recover from that well. So I think it’s really important for us to step in and look after ourselves now at this point in our life, to protect our future selves, and I think one of the causes of us having a lower bone density for this age group. I was born in 77.Dr Angela Genoni: 21:16

I don’t know about you, but back when I went through high school, the thing we did to maintain our weight was just to not eat much. You know, as teenage girls is that that’s what we did. You know, I think a whole generation of us probably didn’t eat enough calcium when we were younger because we were, we were more concerned with how we looked, and, yeah, it’s, it’s crazy. Yeah, I look back at my past self and think, you know, you look at photos of yourself when you’re younger and think how gorgeous you were, and then, at the time, you never see that though, do you?Caroline Balinska: 21:53

I remember my mom saying that to me all the time. Yeah, when I was like, I used to get picked on by my so-called best friend saying that you’re so ugly.Caroline Balinska: 22:01

All the boys think you’re ugly and I used to cry to my mom and my mom would say you’re not, you just don’t understand it yet yeah and it’s amazing that at that time, what we think of ourselves, what we think of ourselves as being fat or ugly or not good enough, or yeah, it sticks, doesn’t it? And I have a daughter now. You’ve got three sons, and I think there is a difference with how, now, what you’re teaching your sons. I’m sure that you’re teaching them certain things about, um, especially women, but I hear how I speak to my daughter now and so many times I catch myself because I say to her oh, you’re so beautiful.Caroline Balinska: 22:33

I’m like no, no, and you’re smart, yeah, and you’re brave and you’re strong, yeah, yeah yeah, exactly because, um, I think what we went through that generation and I was just listening to a podcast about that yesterday, about how, yeah, I’m a couple of years younger than you, so it was that heroin chic, like it was about being as skinny as possible?Dr Angela Genoni: 22:52

Yeah, exactly that was the trend, wasn’t it? Yeah?Caroline Balinska: 22:54

And we didn’t even know what protein meant. Like I remember I was listening to something, just recently actually, where I realised a couple of years ago I needed to do a lot more weightlifting. I found out all of that information and someone said, oh yeah, but I don’t want to get too muscly. And I was the same. I was like I don’t want to get too muscly. And then someone said, yeah, because you see all these women walking around with these really big muscles all the time. It’s just like we don’t realize.Caroline Balinska: 23:20

But the scariest part is and anyone listening to this podcast realize and but the scariest part is and I’m anyone listening to this podcast I’m so um proud of those people because I’ve got a couple of my girlfriends who I adore and I love them so much. However, here we are in our mid-40s and I was talking to one of my friends. She wants to lose some weight and she said I’m gonna go running and I’m like, no, don’t run, you’re not like you’re not gonna lose weight from running. You need to build muscle, because the more muscle you have, muscle breakdown fat and she’s like what?Caroline Balinska: 23:49

and I’m like what’s going on here and I’m like, am I the only one that knows it? And I’m like I’ve got a podcast and I’ve got people that come on my podcast and teach me like I don’t know this stuff myself. I’m taught these things from learning it from other people and I think that’s one of the biggest lessons I’ve learned. For women over 40 is more protein, because the more protein you have, the better it is for your muscle mass, which means we’re not going through this situation of worried about losing weight because it’s just naturally happening in a more yeah, much more natural, organic way than trying to go for a run to lose weight.Dr Angela Genoni: 24:24

I talk about protein in my book too, because protein we know the evidence is quite clear that we need a little bit more protein in our diet than perhaps we previously thought we did, particularly for women in older age. But the one thing that makes it a little complicated is that protein, when it gets to the colon, is not desirable, because when bacteria ferment protein they produce a lot of toxic metabolites and many of those things are associated with colorectal cancer. So it’s got to be a very balanced, a very balanced that is individual and you have to kind of gauge it yourself. You know, if your farts are really smelly, then it’s probably a little bit too much protein fermentation happening in in the gut. And eating some more fiber and balancing it out is the right approach, but it’s a really it when you add in all of these complicating factors around.Dr Angela Genoni: 25:25

Yes, we need more protein, but protein’s bad in the colon. Um, we need to do some weight training, we need to also maintain our vo2 max and have some cardio fitness. You know it’s it’s hard to make sense of that and put that all into perspective, which is kind of why I wrote the book really, because I wanted to help people understand the science without the overwhelm that goes with it, and you mentioned there fibre and I put this on my list because I said too at the start, there’s quite a few fake stories out there.Caroline Balinska: 25:57

There’s some like crazy stuff going on in especially. I love the internet and I love podcasts, but there’s also a lot of podcasts out there that are spreading misinformation. And that was the whole idea of this podcast was I wanted to get guests on here that spoke from a science point of view, because I have moved and I was saying this last week in an interview that I have moved away. I was very much science-based my whole life. I was like going to woo woo. I was not into all this spiritual stuff, but I have found in the last few years that there is more out there about spiritual stuff and less known scientific information. I think gut health is one of those things that’s now more known about. We didn’t have a lot of information in that space. So there is this really scary complicated balance that we need to get somewhere between the science that’s available and things that are just coming into play now that we’re not completely understanding, and that’s where I wanted this podcast to sit at that spot.Caroline Balinska: 26:59

But there’s so much information out there. That’s misinformation. I just heard something the other day that was like fiber is bad for you, we don’t actually need fibre and you feel like you’re not reaching fibre and you laugh when I say that. But this is out there at the moment that there’s a line that we thought fibre was so important. So laugh and explain. I would love to know what you think about that.Dr Angela Genoni: 27:21

I’ve had a few. I’ve got sucked into having a few arguments on threads with people that try and tell me that fiber is not essential. So, basically, when we eat, food goes into our stomach and then to our small intestine right, and our human cells take up what they need from the small intestine, which is where we get our energy and our vitamins and our minerals. They come from the small intestine and then the leftovers go to our amazon rainforest in the colon or, as I also like to call it, like a compost bin. So in technical terms, our human cells don’t need fiber because that’s not their job. They don’t take up the fiber, they don’t use it, but the bacteria that are in the colon, that’s their food. So if you don’t feed them, what are they eating? They’re going to eat your cell walls lining or they’re going to eat the mucus layer lining your colon. They’re hungry, they’ll eat what they can, and if that food that’s provided for them is only protein and fat and some minimal vegetables, then that gut environment is not going to be a healthy one.Dr Angela Genoni: 28:36

So the evidence is very clear that the more fiber we have, the healthier our gut environment is have, the healthier our gut environment is and the better our health outcomes are. So we die less, we get less chronic disease, we have less risk of diabetes, we have less risk of cardiovascular disease. We even have less risk of some and a lot of cancers as well. So it’s not just a little reduction in risk we’re talking like. It can have a major impact on your life by eating more fiber. And the cutoff that Australia set of around 30 grams a day is probably also a little bit on the low side for maintaining a very healthy gut environment. If you look at traditional hunter-gatherer populations, they could eat anywhere from 40 to 100 grams of fiber, depending on where you look. So most things in nutrition, more does not equal better, but for fiber, more is better, and the more that you can fit into your diet, the healthier your gut environment will be, and that’s a real take-home message.Dr Angela Genoni: 29:52

And the other thing I just want to add about fiber is that it’s one word, right, like you say, fiber, but in fact it’s like several hundred different compounds that make up that fall under that definition of fiber. So it’s not just one type of compound that feeds the bacteria in there. There’s hundreds of different molecules that make up that definition and they’re all different chain lengths, they’re all different brand, they have different levels of branching, they’re different structures which feed specifically different types of bacteria that are in your colon, and so to have a truly healthy gut you have to have a variety of those fibers. So you can’t just eat a purely meat diet and supplement with one fiber supplement, because that’s not going to feed the other 999 species that are in your gut. So it’s a complex ecosystem and we have to feed it with complex range of fibres.Caroline Balinska: 30:56

Well, I didn’t realise that. I didn’t realise that I thought fibre was like vitamin C.Dr Angela Genoni: 31:03

Yeah, and a lot of people do, because it’s one word. It’s been the way that nutrition developed. It was like it was developed, yeah, and it was developed in the time when, I guess, the vitamins were developed. So they kind of put all the leftover things that our human body couldn’t use and put it in one bucket and said, okay, we we’re going to call that fiber, because it’s the leftover parts of the plant cell walls that don’t get used in the small intestine, so we’ll call that fiber. But really that’s a very broad range of molecules that make up that definition.Caroline Balinska: 31:42

Wow, okay, so I just learned something new’s how I love it yeah, I didn’t realize that.Caroline Balinska: 31:47

I want to ask you a little bit more about that in a second because, um, I want to get into a little bit more step by step. But I’ve got another question for you about um. I heard the other day a podcast, uh, a video, and I laughed. I thought this was hilarious.Caroline Balinska: 32:03

This guy gets on and he was actually on the joe rogan show, which really annoys me because I think that a lot of stuff he does is also misinformation and it’s very scary. I don’t want to slam people, but like, yeah, he’s got guests on there saying things like what I’m about to tell you. He had a guest on there and the guest said I went on a potato diet and lost I don’t know 20 kilos in two weeks, something like that, cause he spoke in pounds, so I don’t know exactly, um, but, and he showed it before and after photo and he said, yeah, just only ate potatoes. And Joe Rogan was like, wow, that’s amazing. And the guy’s like, but I didn’t put any cream on them, I didn’t put any mayonnaise on them, I didn’t put any butter on them, it was just plain potatoes and nothing else.Caroline Balinska: 32:42

And I’m like yes, if you’re gonna eat plain potatoes with nothing. It’s the, it was the cream, it was the mayonnaise, it was the butter, it was all those other things. You’re putting all these like extra sauces. It was all that like processed food that you were eating. It’s not the fact that you’re on a potato diet, it’s the fact that you cut out all the other crap. Yeah, and Joe Rogan’s acting like this guy’s like just invented the sun, and I was like I get so frustrated by stories like this because to me it’s like spreading absolute BS on what’s actually going on in the body. So and I was reading the comments and someone’s like, yeah, you could just go on any one food diet and have the same results. So how about you just tell us a little bit about what you think about that?Dr Angela Genoni: 33:27

Yes, there’s two things sort of that I want to comment on there, and that is firstly, potatoes are a good food. So I love potatoes and I’m very big on people eating potatoes, because they’re actually quite high in resistant starch. Especially if you cook them and then let them cool down a little bit, the starch will cross link on itself a bit and it becomes resistant to digestion and becomes food for your gut bacteria. So potatoes which are cooked and cooled are fantastic for your gut and the weight loss probably resulted from stimulating some good bacterial populations in the gut because he was eating a high amount of resistant starch over those few weeks, or however long he did it for. But primarily, I think you lose weight on that kind of diet because you are so bored, like if you tell yourself you can only eat one food, then you’re going to get sick of it.Dr Angela Genoni: 34:26

You’re going to get sick of it and you’re just going to decide that you’re not hungry anymore because you don’t want to stomach another potato for the day. So I think the main reason that we we see weight loss so rapid with that is the the one food and also there’s no. Potatoes are very low calorie as well. When you don’t put anything on them they’re very low calorie, but they’re also very satiating, so they make you feel quite full because they’re quite starchy. So they will fill you up with very little calories and that’s why you can probably do that kind of diet for a few days and not suffer too much, because the potatoes are quite filling. But those are the reasons for the rapid weight loss. I think there was a story in Australia a couple of years ago about a guy who did a similar thing with potatoes. So it’s not a new media fad story, but it’s certainly funny when they come out.Caroline Balinska: 35:26

And I think that for what we spoke about before, for women, worst idea in the world on that diet because you need protein.Caroline Balinska: 35:33

Like I will scream all day all along. My friend actually a friend of mine actually said she’s going to go on a potato diet herself and I was like, no, you need to have protein, you need protein. Like you could go I don’t know what your opinion is you could do it with, could go I? I don’t know what your opinion is. You could do it with salmon and potatoes, but don’t just do potato diet like that’s got to be the worst thing in the world. Because, um, that guy and the people in the comments were like, yeah, he probably lost some weight, but he also lost a lot of muscle mass as well.Dr Angela Genoni: 35:59

Yeah, he would have. Yeah, and there’s no doubt about that, we do. If you’re going sort of on calorie restriction, if you calorie restrict but consume adequate protein, then the loss of muscle mass is reduced. So you know, when we lose fat, when we lose weight, we don’t just lose fat, we lose fat and lean mass. And so the idea of losing weight is to lose less lean mass and more body fat, and you don’t do that by just having carbs, because you’re going to lose everything and there will be a lot more protein lost in the form of muscle as well.Caroline Balinska: 36:35

And for women over the age of 40, it’s much harder to build up that, because we are losing muscle mass much after, as we get older, and then we can’t get it back as easily.Dr Angela Genoni: 36:46

So the worst thing you can do is lose any of that muscle mass and also a diet that’s restrictive like that is not good for us mentally either. Like you know when and I don’t focus on weight with my clients at all because I feel like at this point in our lives we need to be focusing on things that are much more positive for us. So if that might be, they want to get fit enough to go hiking in Peru next year, or they want to be able to run five kilometers, to go and run, park run with their kids, or whatever that goal might be things that are positive are more likely to be successful than telling yourself you have to lose something because that doesn’t make you feel good, and I don’t. I think we’re done with with that now. At this point in our lives, we need to build ourselves up a bit and focus on things for the right reasons, and that reason has got to be us.Caroline Balinska: 37:44

And I can tell you from my experience with people that I know is that when you’re focusing on weight, you’re not focusing on weight. This is what I’ve always found. People are not focusing on what’s right for them. They’re looking at what everyone else is doing and deciding that I want her body, therefore I need to look like her, and it’s like well, every single body shape is different, like every single person is different, and I know it’s always been sort of a problem for me because I’ve always had.Caroline Balinska: 38:18

When I was younger, I had no weight problem. You said like in your teenage years you were not eating. I literally used to eat like a horse. I was pulled out of class because they thought my parents weren’t feeding me because I was. So I had like a problem where I was skinny and so I could not put on weight. I just I’m like you have no idea how much I eat. I cannot put on weight. So I had the opposite problem. But when I got into my perimenopause years, that changed and I started to now like now I actually probably am normal and I do put on weight.Caroline Balinska: 38:48

But what I find is if I’m concentrating on weight loss, my mental health is frustrated about. I’m thinking about like, am I going to fit into that dress? Whereas all I concentrate now on is getting enough muscle mass, making sure I’m fit, making sure that I can go for like he said, going for that walk, that I’m not feeling tired after I’ve gone for a long walk. I just did 20,000 steps. The other day we were in London. I did 20,000 steps and did not even bother me at all. So that comes from the fact that I’m making sure that I’m fit, not because I’m worried about my weight. And what I found also is it naturally falls off when you’re thinking about all the healthy reasons why you’re doing it.Dr Angela Genoni: 39:30

Yeah, that is so true and you know, it’s the reason that I maintain my fitness too. You know, I’ve got teenage boys and we just went to Italy a few weeks ago and they wanted me to come on this canyoning adventure with them and it was hardcore. It was like six hours of hiking and jumping and abseiling and I was just, you know, blessed with myself that I was hiking up the mountain and wasn’t puffing because I’m so fit and I was just like, and the boys were proud of me and it’s just, it’s so cool to miss that experience. Yeah, no, I didn’t sit it out because I wasn’t fit enough and I’m, you know, grateful to myself for showing up.Dr Angela Genoni: 40:07

You, no, I didn’t sit it out because I wasn’t fit enough and I’m, you know, grateful to myself for showing up, you know, when I didn’t want to half the time to to go and do those sessions when you don’t feel like it, and but you know, when you’re doing it for the right reasons, it’s actually a lot easier to focus on the positives rather than getting down on yourself because you couldn’t stick to a meal plan or something. Because, let’s face it, if you’ve got children, then sticking to any kind of rigid diet is exceptionally difficult. You know, things can go pear-shaped so fast when you’ve got a family to look after, and we don’t need that restriction anymore. We just need to know how to nurture ourselves properly, because then we have that inner confidence to know what to do. And that’s where, you know, we can really get our power back.Caroline Balinska: 40:51

Yeah, I love that. Tell me a little bit about your book and also tell me a little bit about anyone listening. What would they need to do to get started? Because I think now we’ve explained a lot of different scenarios. But let’s say someone’s sitting there going yeah, this is. I actually need to change something about my situation. So I think your book explains that a little bit. But yeah, where would you suggest people start with that?Dr Angela Genoni: 41:17

So I have, I have a book, and the book came about a little bit by accident actually, because I I had done a lot of research for the program that I have written and, in the purpose of, you know, putting some of the research together, I thought, oh, this might make a good book. And, yeah, six months later it’s done, it’s finished and it’s out. So it’s great and I’m super chuffed with it actually. So it’s basically encompasses the messages that we’ve just chatted about today around helping people understand the big picture science of gut health, but putting it in a perspective that helps you make sense of that complex science and tries not to overwhelm people but help you navigate it in a way that is practical and I think, particularly for women. The science is cool, but really the so what factor is the most important thing for you? Is like, okay, that’s really nice, but how do I actually use that in my life? And, yeah, that’s those are the messages that I wanted to help people with. So the the book is an extension of the program that I run, and the program that I run is, um, it’s a self-paced program, but because I’m really big on the sort of compassion and the kindness and the community aspect of what I do inside the program. There’s also like virtual catch-ups where we meet and we have monthly topics on various things so people can engage with the content. So it’s not like I don’t like when people just throw nutrition information at people without actually providing the guidance and love and support that goes with it, because we we need that at the moment and I think for women particularly, that’s really important. So I work through you know, there’s eight weeks of content where we work through all the four pillars of gut health, and so it’s not just about diet and fiber and we delve into all of those in detail, but it’s also about how you navigate all of that complex information around food but also how to manage it with lifestyle and stress and the gut brain access and then how it influences your hormones and how to put those pieces together. So it’s a big-picture tour but with practical tools along the way to navigate. So people leave feeling like they know what to do with their body going forward. Fantastic.Dr Angela Genoni: 43:43

And what are the four pillars of gut health? So the four pillars, that and this is sort of an approach that came to me one night, you know, when you’re just half asleep and you wake up with an idea. That’s kind of how this four-pillared approach came about, because I was trying to think about the best way to put the science together so that it made sense together so that it made sense. And so the four pillars of gut health are the first part is fiber and all the components of fiber, so feeding your bacteria properly. So bacterial fuel is the first pillar, and then bacterial supplements is the second pillar, but that’s all about. Bacterial supplements is the second pillar, but that’s all about looking at things like polyphenols and all the other components in food which don’t directly feed the bacteria but they influence the bacteria. So all of those nice colorful compounds in food we talk about alcohol and preservatives and things in ultra processed foods that can also impact your bacterial populations.Dr Angela Genoni: 44:48

And then pillar three looks at lifestyle, so stress and exercise, how those influence your gut bacteria and then linking that with the gut brain access.Dr Angela Genoni: 44:58

So we talk about your gut talking to your brain, but also your brain talking to your gut, and so we work on it from both angles, because people who have gut issues often only focus on the diet, but their thinking can also influence their gut, so we need to work on things from both angles, because otherwise you can work on your diet and you might not get anywhere, but really it’s adding in some exercise and perhaps a bit of mindfulness training or meditation that can really finally shift things to where you want to be.Dr Angela Genoni: 45:38

And then the last pillar is environment.Dr Angela Genoni: 45:40

So things like social connections and being outdoors can have a big impact on our gut microbiome and it’s really cool science, but it’s actually really important for our mental health as well. So putting those pieces of the science together and then all of those pillars are underpinned by our mindset. So I talk about it as watering a garden, you know, and the pillars are like four plants. And unless you water the garden with knowledge and understanding, but you have a mindset, which is a growth mindset, to enable those plants to grow, then you really can flourish and grow the whole garden properly. And we talk about the way we talk to ourselves and what we say to ourselves in the mirror and how we think about food and how we think about reframing some of those things, so that we do end up on those more positive discussions with ourself rather than looking in the mirror and saying, oh my God, I’m so fat, because that’s not helpful for us anymore and it’s not going to help us be the best versions of who we’re meant to be.Caroline Balinska: 46:51

Okay, so I have a question for you. It wasn’t on my list. Yeah, it’s popped in. I’m putting you on the spot If there’s a woman listening now and she’s thinking to herself. But I’ve tried it. I’ve tried the diets, I’ve tried the eating healthy, I’ve tried the mindset stuff. I’ve tried, tried, tried, tried, tried, tried. And here I am not in a good place still. What would you tell her to do? To start off with, where would you? What’s her first baby step that you would recommend to her?Dr Angela Genoni: 47:19

Okay, so the first thing is that she needs to have her confidence back, and I think that’s the key here, and the confidence comes from within. So we need to work on that from two angles. The first is the mindset, and the second is knowing in a bit more intimate detail about what the gut’s actually doing on the inside, so understanding what the problems are like. What are the issues? Is it bloating or is it constipation? You know what is the issues that we’re facing and how can we specifically change your diet to manage those things.Dr Angela Genoni: 48:01

And then the thing that I do, quite differently to other nutrition programs, is I don’t advocate for people changing their diet all at once. I think that’s completely unsustainable, and so you have to do it in a way that works for you. And if you learn to be the master of your own nutrition, you don’t have to feel like you’re trying things all the time, because you just know what you need to do. Once you’ve got the tools, you know what you need to do and you know how to do it. And that’s the part of bringing back confidence that can really empower people for lasting health, and that’s the end goal, isn’t it right? We all want to be the best versions of ourselves in 20 years’ time still. So that’s where we want to get to, and we want to do it in a way that benefits us mentally, spiritually, emotionally and for our body as well.Caroline Balinska: 48:59

I think what I took away from there was and I love that what she says that they don’t need to change their diet all at one time, because I think that a lot of women are told throw out everything, and then you’ve got to go out and buy a whole new pantry of food and you’ve got to think about this, this and this, and you’re going to have to make a diet plan for the next 30 days because you’re going to have to work out everything that you’re going to eat and blah, and it just becomes overwhelming, like it’s yeah, it’s so overwhelming.Caroline Balinska: 49:21

I’ve tried that before and it doesn’t work for me and I don’t think it works for anyone, unless you’re a robot.Dr Angela Genoni: 49:26

Yeah, and when, even like even I and I talk a little bit. I think there’s a couple of paragraphs in my book about the biggest loser, because there’s a documentary on Netflix now about the biggest loser. But you know and quite coincidentally I’d already talked about that in my book as well because what they did with those people on that that show, well, it was like a game show, but it was a reality show. What they did is they went in and cleaned out their whole pantry and replaced it with different foods and, yes, that is overwhelming and unless you’ve got the habits in place and the systems in place to support that new lifestyle, it’s not going to be sustainable.Dr Angela Genoni: 50:07

Because, let’s face it, if people listening have got a family or a full-time job, you know that’s hard, that’s really hard to manage life, just keeping on top of your life, admin and your grocery shopping, let alone trying to cook dinner every night of the week. So you know, I hear you and it just it can’t be that way if it’s going to be successful and that’s why I’m very much an advocate for helping people just implement one small thing at a time, because that builds your confidence too right, if you change one thing and you can do that successfully and give yourself a gold star on the fridge at the end of the week because you did that. You know that builds you up and that’s what we need to be doing more of.Caroline Balinska: 50:52

Yeah, I love that For someone who after all my stomach stuff. I slightly told you, but at one stage I went 28 days with no food. I did that two different times that I had to clean out my stomach. I did a full reset and I had to be on a special amino acid protein thing and thinking that that was when my problem laid. I told you it’s not where it laid, but I’ve had zero food in my stomach for 28 days, where it was crazy and what I went through in that process on two different occasions, while still cooking all the family meals for four kids.Dr Angela Genoni: 51:23

That was intense.Caroline Balinska: 51:28

But I’ve been through every single type of and mine’s all been because of allergies. But trying to go through those things at that extreme level it’s never going to work successfully. And the difference of like what you’re just saying, one small thing that I changed because of what you just mentioned, and that must be what I’m. I didn’t know it was because five is different things but, for example, adding in different colours of lettuces.Dr Angela Genoni: 51:55

Yeah, yeah.Caroline Balinska: 51:56

And that actually is a big thing that they say, and that must be what you’re talking about. I’m guessing that it’s a different type of fibre in each different colour. Yep, and that was just a small thing that I implemented Instead of going to the shop now. I never buy iceberg lettuce. I buy it occasionally if I want to do wraps or something, but generally I don’t use the basic lettuce. I buy it occasionally if I want to do wraps or something, but generally I don’t use the basic lettuce. Yes, okay, it costs a bit more to have the other lettuces, but I make sure that that is because I say, okay, I’m spending a bit more on those lettuces, but I’m buying the different colored ones and that means that I’m getting more different nutrition into my diet.Dr Angela Genoni: 52:30

And those are just one simple things that you can do to start with. You know those simple things and in fact, if it’s just adding in one apple a day for a week, you know those. That’s an extra couple of grams of fiber just by itself and some, you know, over a couple of weeks. You think about if you add in a couple of changes like that, you start stacking things together and then all of a sudden you’re hitting your fiber goals and you’re feeling better and that that was easy and it doesn’t have to be hard if you do it with the right mindset and you understand the why, the why behind it, so that you kind of got a feel for what it is that you might need to do next. So you know you might add in some apples, apples or whatever, but you need a bit of confidence to understand what else might be a gap in terms of the other types of fibres that you need as well.Caroline Balinska: 53:23

And I think another thing if you’ve got kids under 18 that are still living at home, I think the good thing about doing it that way as well is it’s a little bit sneaky for them that they’re not getting overwhelmed because they think a kid going what you mean that I’m not going to eat all of this stuff anymore. And then you throw again like well, today we’re going to have like a little fruit salad with yogurt instead of having nothing at the end of our like all of those little things, and then you just add it into the natural progression of you know, I have this argument with my daughter all the time, because she’s with her dad sometimes, and then she comes to me. I’m like how many fruits did you have? Yesterday I had a banana. And I’m like did you have any other fruit? No, and I’m like okay, well, so you have to have at least three different fruits.Caroline Balinska: 54:00

Yeah, and I live in a country where fruit is not a great. Vegetables are not great here. It’s terrible. I tell people about Australia how amazing the supermarkets are. Here. It’s terrible. So it’s yeah, you don’t get the same sort of fruit and vegetables that I’m used to. So I’m like you have to have at least three fruits a day, and then she’s like, oh, but I don’t want to have them. And having that argument with a child, why don’t you see that it’s part of the well, that’s what we do here. It becomes part of the routine.Dr Angela Genoni: 54:31

Yeah, and it can be quite hard when you’ve got kids too, because they go through that teenage phase where they just want what their friends have got and most of the time that’s just junk. And you know I’ve got boys and they’re all bigger than me, so you know they just eat an ungodly amount of food at the moment. So we best not discuss my grocery bills, but I have to say that you know they’re at that time where they just want to eat junk because that’s what their friends are doing. But what they get to eat when they’re here is, you know, a nutritious dinner and we sit down and we eat it together, because food is more than food.Dr Angela Genoni: 55:10

It’s also love and connection, and you know it’s our time to chat for the day and catch up on what everyone’s been up to. So, yes, we sit down for a nutritious meal, but it’s sort of it’s the culture of the food where we do it with love. You know that’s part of eating right. It has to be fun and find our joy in having food. So I just hope that I set enough of a role model so that when they go out on their own that they just fall back on eating the types of foods that they had when they were here with me, because that’s what I showed them was a good, healthy lifestyle. They’re off on their teenage years at the moment, but they’ll come come back around, I’m sure.Caroline Balinska: 55:58

I’ve got a whole story about that I’ve done on a podcast episode. Before that I’ve got four step kids. I had four step kids and they refused. They were used to eating three meals and that was it three different dishes. And when they met me, coming from my Polish heritage, so I made a lot of Polish food I made growing up in Melbourne, where it’s a foodie culture yeah, I’m like really into cooking. They would come home, they’d come to our house and they’d just walk in the door and go ew, I’m not eating that. It smells disgusting. I’m like you haven’t even seen it, you don’t know what’s in it.Dr Angela Genoni: 56:27

I haven’t tried it.Caroline Balinska: 56:28

And then they refused to eat anything because I was just used to eating these three dishes and that was it on their mother’s side. And then when they came to us, their dad wasn’t you know, he was busy with work. So I got into a thing where I started saying hang on a second. We have to set a rule that you have to at least try it and if at least two of you don’t like the meal, I won’t cook it again. I’m not here to cook something for you that you’re going to hate. I’m not trying to make you hate food. I’m letting you experience different foods because just because you think you don’t like it doesn’t mean that you’re not going to like it. And then we set a rule in our house that was actually a great one where we said every single kid gets to have one food they never have to eat, and that one food that they could change it every six months. So whatever that one thing was and they could change it. So at first they were like but I don’t like that, but I don’t like that.Caroline Balinska: 57:13

So then we set this rule and it was funny, the youngest girl. She was like 10 at the time, or 8 at the time. Actually, she was like 8. She was the one that had like the most amount of food she hated and then we said, okay, what’s your one food you’re not going to eat? And she never set her food and the whole time I was with that family for nearly eight years we were she never said a food in the end, and if she didn’t have a food she wasn’t allowed to say no to that meal and all the other ones had their.Caroline Balinska: 57:41

Like one kid, he hated capsicums, like just hate, like all dry reached from them for no other reason, and so he never had to eat a meal with it. But they were allowed to if they wanted to, and he would always eat pastas with capsicum, but just anything else. He was just like, no, I’m not going to eat it, whereas she never had a food that she put on her list. So then it was like she’d go, I don’t want to eat, and then she’s like, oh, okay, then I’ll eat it. And so it ended up being like that and I found that really interesting. And it’s really interesting to hear them speak about food now and how they speak about food and they say to me all the time they’re like thank you so much for taking us through that experience because I’m so open and they say to me they’ve all said to me my friends are shocked with how many foods I’m willing to try.Dr Angela Genoni: 58:22

Yeah, it’s cool, isn’t it? And you don’t realise it when you’re young, but you know, even when you look at the research now around. You know Mediterranean diet, but in fact it’s more than diet for that region because they they prepare the food as a family together and they sit together and have the meal together as a family, and the food is local. And you know food is more than food because we it’s an experience, isn’t it? We try new things, we do it together, we share it together and it’s important not to lose sight of that with food, that it’s often more than the food and the numbers that it comprises. It’s an emotional part of being human and we forget that and people argue about all the little details. But stepping back and just going no, it’s dinner. I’m out with my friends, I’m going to have a try a new thing and enjoy it.Caroline Balinska: 59:20

Do you have any of your son’s friends say anything about? Do they eat with your family and do they mention the way your culture is around food at home? Because I had a lot of that from the other kids, their friends. They were like, wow, it’s really like how I am in my home.Dr Angela Genoni: 59:36

We have some really nice meals here. Their friends they were like wow, it’s really. Yeah, we, we have. How I am in my home, we have, um, we have some really nice meals here. Like I really value food and I so I buy. You know, I buy a nice pasta or I make. My son loves cooking. Actually he’s inherited my love of food so he loves cooking and he’ll make fresh pasta.Dr Angela Genoni: 59:52

Sometimes we have a lot of like nice quality things. You know, if I’m buying something, I make sure I buy the nice stuff. If it’s cheese, it’s nice cheese. Or if it’s olives, I buy the good olives, but we do. The kids are very open to trying new things as a result of having a broad range of things offered to them here, which is nice. And you know, when we went to Italy just recently that was their first time overseas and they tried everything and I’m so proud of them because they just they did, they just tried, they tried everything. And, yeah, hats off to them for just being brave enough, because I know a lot of people just won’t do that when they go away yeah, even as adults, yeah yeah yeah, fantastic.Caroline Balinska: 1:00:34

So I would love to know if someone wanted to read your book or they wanted to know more about you, or if they wanted to jump in.Dr Angela Genoni: 1:00:40

You’ve got a free program that you offer as well yes yes, I’ve got on the um on my website or perhaps I can drop a drop a link for you to pop in um under your. So yeah, there’s access in there. You can start the program for free. Actually, there’s a master class and a free download that you can get started on for free. No, no credit card or anything required, just just an email address. Um, and also my book is available on amazoncom as an e-book. I can’t ship, uh, worldwide just yet. I’m australia post has just suspended shipping to the US with the tariffs, but the e-book is available on Amazon and I’m just arranging Amazon print to do the hard copies if people want a hard copy. But if your listeners are in Australia, you can buy a hard copy off my website. Soon to be in bookstores also.Caroline Balinska: 1:01:36

Fantastic. Well, you were waiting this morning to have it delivered to your home, the hard copy. You were getting a copy of it. So we haven’t actually seen the copy yet because you haven’t even seen it.Dr Angela Genoni: 1:01:46

Well, I have got some samples here, but yes, I’m very proud. It’s turned out so well and, yeah, it’s taken a lot of work. But to see it in the flesh is you know, it’s pretty exciting.Caroline Balinska: 1:02:00

Fantastic Congratulations. I’m writing a book at the moment as well, so I know how much work goes into it and especially trying to get your thoughts in your situation on paper in a way that people understand it. Yeah, and I do love the way you explain things. I think you explain everything in a really nice way, because sometimes I have guests on the podcast and they get very technical and they get into the whole science and especially when you’re passionate about it, it makes sense. But I love the way you explain things because it makes it really simple for women who all they want to do is just have a nice life and they want to make sure that they’re healthy and they can look after themselves. So I love the way you explain it and your book. I look forward to reading it. So I look forward to reading it.Dr Angela Genoni: 1:02:42

You brought in something about fibre. Yeah, one of my friends actually said it was reading the book was like having a conversation with me and I thought that was really sweet because, yeah, it is hard to de-science some of it because you know you do need to go into it a little bit to help you understand it, but it’s an art of just trying to make it so that it’s applicable and real and that’s the fun part.Caroline Balinska: 1:03:05

I love it. Okay, fantastic, angela. It was so great having you on the podcast and I’m sure that once you know, we get some more information about different scientific information that is changing women’s lives. I’m going to get you back on here again at another stage as well. So if anyone wants to learn more about you, they can get into your free program, they can get your book on Amazon and I’ll leave all the notes in there. I’ll leave the links in the show notes so people can get hold of you and thank you so much for joining us today. Thank you, it was lovely to have a chat. Thanks, angela, and thanks everyone.